abortion is murder, huh? but what to do with us?

punkmama's picture

this is so incredibly interesting. the maker of this video asks protesters outside abortion clinics whether abortion should be legal or illegal, and of course they say illegal, because it is murder, killing. then he asks, well what should the punishment be? the same as for murder? needless to say they had nothing to say.
you gotta watch this.
i know that i work in an abortion clinic, so i am biased, but i deal with our protesters as little as possible. but i think this little video is awesome without being inflammatory...and is very thought provoking. if it is murder, why would they not automatically suggest penalizing a woman who has an abortion as a murderer?
i think that there is a pathology, a mental illness, involved with these protesters. not that people who oppose abortion for themselves are necessarily mentally ill, but these protesters absolutely are. the preoccupation with the unborn, the bizarre inability to process their beliefs all the way through (as demonstrated in this video)...they are so delusional, bit we tolerate them and their christian bullshit just like we tolerate all the other hate filled judgmental christian bullshit...why don't we call them on it? one of the doctors i work with was saying that if they defeat us, if they win, it will be because they are undivided as only brainwashed soldiers can be, whereas we aren't zealous enough, and we draw lines. like, well, you can have one or two, but you "shouldn't" have 7, and the ridiculous lines between weeks...i hear it all day, like, 8 weeks isn't as "bad" as 14. what? man it wears me out.
any thoughts?


urbanearthmama's picture

I found this strangly funny...also, interesting--I guess women who have abortions are just "unaware" of what they're doing?
Those people on the video creeped me out.
How can I get this off of my finger without betraying my cool exterior? --Fox Mulder

Mummy's alright, Daddy's alright, they just seem a little weird...

Ericka's picture
Submitted by Ericka on

as a pro-abortion, two abortion having woman myself, I have conflicted feelings about abortion protesters. For the most part, I just like protesting, and while I have had those two abortions and don't regret them at all, but for the most part I feel like they are right, abortion is killing. I am glad that they are there and passionate enough to try and stop or make a big deal out of something that they think is just horrific. If they attribute abortions to the same kind of atrocity that I see the halocaust, then they are doing the right thing. I heard abortion refered to once as a neccessary evil, and ever since then, I will always feel that way. If there were Jews being held in concentration camps today being ready to be gassed, why I'd be the first person there. And there is no diffrence, because there is no wrong or right, there is only perception. And these people percieve abortion to be as that bad. Me, not even close. They also believe in God, and a God that weeps tears for unborn babies dying, and this god is this end all be all supreme nothing greater than the whole shit and shabang everything beautiful whatever have you entity that for some reason you shouldn't cross. I do not. But I understand that they do. So theres all this other added pressure and inspiration, because they think they are pleasing him and doing his work. And as far as the having two and not seven, well I think there is a diffrence as do most people. Abortion to almost everybody whether they admit it or not is beyond a simple medical procedure, and as far as mental illness goes, it seems like the women that I know that have had many abortions are not stable and do exhibit obvious traits of mental illness themselves. Even if its from a completely removed place apoart from the fetus. Abortion is very trying on a woman's body, and if she doesn't even respect her own health and physical nature enough to take procautions to not have to endure abortion number seven, to me that a gigantic red flag. And yes I can point the finger at myself as well for having two instead of one, although I was using the shot which obviosuly didn't work.

One thing though, is seriously if God is so great and powerful and perfect, and in control of everything why don't they ever stop and think that maybe God wants abortions? Just a thought.

What does bother me though, is that when I was in the position of having an abortion the first and second time, the reasons came down to money. And that is quite honestly the case in most unplanned pregnancies. And these people- the anti-abortion protesters don't offer any other resources for these women. All they say is adoption. Well you know what? Fuck adoption. It may be fine for some girls/women but most of us don't want to lug around a baby for nine months, advirtise it to the world, wear that scarlet letter, and then agonize over the desicions for the rest of our lives. If they cared so gosh damned much than why aren't their funds to pay our rent? Why can't these people sponser a family that just can't work a new baby into the budget? Why is it all they are ever willing to do is to point us to where the WIC office is, as if that solves anything? They can say that they care, but when it comes down to it, money talks and bullshit walks and sometimes it walks with a picket sign. I don't see any of those bitches driving a clunker and living ten deep in a bungalow so they can pool their resources and give till it hurts so that some woman that wants to have her baby can.

And as far as these abortion doctors go, another thing that pisses me off is abortion is NOT affordable. At all. And if a woman can't afford to have an abortion, how is she supposed to be able to support a baby. But do they care? No. So abortion is an option only for a certain income bracket. But the ones that need it the most have parenthood inflicted apon them. And to me, that just so unfair.

Oh I also wanted to add that I am not being judgemental about women that decide to terminate their pregnancy for reasons other than financial, I could care less and its none of my business why anybody makes that choice.

newleaf's picture
Submitted by newleaf on

that the people interviewed hadn't thought about the women at all. And they had this pretty naive belief that making abortion illegal would just make it so no-one ever had an abortion again.
Why be involved in something for a couple of years and not think about the consequences of what you're trying to have happen?

All little girls should be told they're pretty--even if they aren't.
--Marilyn Monroe

Creatress's picture
Submitted by Creatress on

I would not consider their "hate-filled, judgemental...bullshit" to be Christian.

Maybe this is just the linguist arguing semantics, but while they may self-identify as Christian, Jesus would not be there shouting at the women entering the clinic; he'd be holding their hands.

Now, I know that I, of all people, shouldn't be saying who is and who is not "really" Christian, since most members of mainstream Christianity wouldn't let me call myself a Christian (I don't believe in the resurrection, or in hell, or in Mary's virginity...and then there's the fact that I'm queer and poly and a single mom.) But I do feel that Jesus was the best positive role model to ever walk the earth, and in that spirit of social justice, I do identify as a follower of Christ--thus, a Christian.

I did used to be a pro-life protester, coincidentally. Chalk it up to being young (14 or so) and raised in the Midwest. I no longer believe that abortion should be illegal, and I feel that the protesters do far more emotional damage than abortion prevention. At the same time, it's safer and easier for them to just think in black and white instead of the gray area that is ethics.

Having said THAT, I wouldn't rant about the "hate-filled, judgmental christian bullshit" in such a hate-filled and judgmental way. Yes, they're pretty fucked up. But if you want to really eliminate their verbally violent presence, you have to be an unfailing voice of verbal peace. Spitting fire back at them (be it on the street or in a blog) doesn't establish a neutral, rational arena for discussion and revelation (where their opinion may change and you/we may gain some perspective as well). It just fuels the fire.

25/MN and WA. Queer, veg, single, AP mama to DD2.5.

sunflower's picture
Submitted by sunflower on

It's all about who is phrasing the argument. The anti-choicers have controlled the arguments by making us uncomfortable and showing our contradictions. This is what happens when we focus on the procedure, especially with procedural bans, and twisting the discussion to so called "partial birth abortion", late term abortions, and what makes us uncomfortable about it. When we focus on the women involved and what real choice really means, it suddenly is a lot easier to support.

It also makes it pretty clear that even the most strident anti-choicers do not really think it is killing or murder. They can't even imagine sending women to one day in jail - how can that be murder to them?

Sunflower the unflower

Mom's Tinfoil Hat
Foodie loves Picky

Sunflower the unflower

Mom's Tinfoil Hat
Foodie loves Picky

Belle87's picture
Submitted by Belle87 on

...exactly. As it stands, an incredible number of children in the US don't have health insurance. Abortion illegal = pretty happy babies rolling around? Not gonna happen.

The first time I came across a protest I was in shock. I noticed how 'rich' looking the protestors looked, nice suits, expensive looking dresses. I've gotten into discussions with these people and have decided that it just isn't worth it.

anyway, thanks for posting this.

mamaneen's picture
Submitted by mamaneen on

okay, so i'm a misanthrope and an anthrophile, and that causes me some internal abrasions sometimes, but here's what this wee film illustrates to both sides. first, most people are either too stupid or too lazy to think for themselves, but second, even still, most people have too strong a grounding in logic and balance to follow insane brainwashy shit to the next stage without being specifically lead there.

'course, maybe the second part isn't there at all since the flick could be explained entirely by number one, but damnit, i'm gonna keep some hope burning for ol' homo sapiens yet.

"if i pass for other than what i am, do you feel safer?" ~ lani ka'ahumanu

dragon knows dragon

"if i pass for other than what i am, do you feel safer?" ~ lani ka'ahumanu

dragon knows dragon

haley-b's picture
Submitted by haley-b on

It's crazy that people with such "convictions" can become so wishy-washy when asked a straight forward question! I also found it kinda funny that in the end they all seem to be pretty pro-choice, saying that ultimately it's between a woman and her god. Wah!


lapina's picture
Submitted by lapina on

But didn't want to find an noninflammatory way of putting it.
I also have to throw in that extremism is all the same in my view. Extreme Republican/Democrat, Extreme christian/atheist, they all say the same things with different fill in the blank answers. The majority of people are moderates and wish everyone would calm down enough to stop the mudslinging.

We could have saved the Earth but we were too damned cheap.~K.V.

sebsmom's picture
Submitted by sebsmom on

"If there were Jews being held in concentration camps today being ready to be gassed, why I'd be the first person there. And there is no diffrence, because there is no wrong or right, there is only perception."
I have a problem with this because there's a very big difference IMO. Because I think in the case of Jews being gassed in a concentration camp it is absolutely wrong- it has nothing to do with perception. And I don't think anyone would have trouble saying what should happen to the perpetrators of the violence toward Jews in the holocaust. Abortion's not so black and white. It's difficult to say that it's "right" but I think it is absolutely NECESSARY. I get that you're just trying to say that you respect the passion of the protestors and the fact that they're sticking up for what they believe in, but I wouldn't say that protesting a Nazi death camp and protesting an abortion clinic are the same thing-- deep down clearly these protestors don't even believe that or else they'd have no trouble saying that women who have abortions should be punished as murderers.